MADISON, Wis. (AP) — A Wisconsin Elections Commission discussion of uncounted ballots in Madison devolved into a shouting match Thursday, with the Democratic chair threatening to kick a Republican commissioner out of the meeting.
The commission is investigating former Madison City Clerk Maribeth Witzel-Behl after she failed to count 200 absentee ballots in the November election and didn't tell the commission about the oversight until after election results were certified. Witzel-Behl resigned this week.
Commission Chair Ann Jacobs said at a Thursday meeting that she and Commissioner Don Millis had deposed Witzel-Behl as well as other city workers and planned to continue questioning additional workers.
Republican Commissioner Bob Spindell said that he was fine with the Madison investigation, but the commission needs to pay more attention to what he said were even more serious problems with election administration in Milwaukee.
As he attempted to detail his concerns, Jacobs began shouting at him that Milwaukee elections weren't on the agenda. She ordered him to stop talking or she would kick him out.
“I am not going to let you keep going, Bob,” she said, jabbing her finger at him. “I'm going to talk over you until you stop. You must stop. You are out of order, and I will eject you from this meeting if you disobey again.”
“You're going to eject me from the meeting? You're going to try and muzzle me?” Spindell responded.
“Do you understand the words I am saying?” Jacobs said.
“What are you saying?” Spindell said.
“They are simple. You are out of order. The city of Milwaukee is not on this agenda. You don't get to hijack the agenda," Jacobs said.
They continued to shout over each other until Spindell gave up. “I said what I needed to say. Thank you," he said. Jacobs ultimately allowed Spindell to remain in the meeting.
The commission is evenly divided with three Republican commissioners and three Democrats. Spindell was one of 10 Republicans who signed certificates in 2020 falsely stating that Donald Trump had won Wisconsin. Democrat Joe Biden actually won the state that year.
He and Jacobs have been at odds for years, with Spindell often lodging complaints and making motions that Jacobs rules out of order. Much like Thursday's exchange, their interactions have often been marked by Jacobs demanding that he stop talking.
The commission opened an investigation into Witzel-Behl in early January after learning that she had failed to count 193 absentee ballots and didn't inform the commission until Dec. 18, more than two weeks after election results were certified.
The uncounted ballots didn't affect the outcome of any races, but commissioners appeared stunned at the oversight. Four Madison voters whose ballots went uncounted have filed claims for $175,000 each from the city and Dane County, the first step toward a lawsuit. It was another blunder for Witzel-Behl after she announced in September that her office erroneously sent out up to 2,000 duplicate absentee ballots.
Mayor Satya Rhodes-Conway suspended Witzel-Behl in March and launched an internal investigation. Witzel-Behl resigned on Monday. The city has yet to release the findings from its internal probe.
It wasn't clear what Milwaukee voting problems Spindell was referring to on Thursday since Jacobs drowned him out. But he could be heard referencing a report about how some polling stations in Milwaukee ran out of ballots because of higher than anticipated turnout in the state's hotly contested Supreme Court election.
Spindell told reporters after the meeting that he was pushing for an investigation into the ballot shortage, calling it “very, very bad judgment.” He said the issue is more important than the uncounted Madison ballots but Jacobs doesn't want an investigation because she wants to protect the city's Democratic election officials.
After Spindell left, Jacobs told reporters that he must stop hijacking meetings for items that aren't on the agenda. She added that she doesn't understand what Spindell wants out of an investigation.
“An investigation," Jacobs said, “needs to have a purpose other than whining, complaining and conspiracy theories.”
Todd Richmond, The Associated Press
